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  #21  
Old 07-01-2009, 07:34 PM
npecanhuk npecanhuk is offline
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Default Re: What does it mean for you?

Brazil already has famous "Sebastião Salgado" who's perfect in portraying human misery! I like it! I think he's one of the best in his area. However, don't think that's the only photography way of expressing what's in the world! There's war, there's misery, there's diseases of all kinds and levels of seriousness! Good and talented photographers are the ones who register all that, specially in black and white to make it even more rude, cruel and a good reason for us to have pitiful feelings! Sunshine is forbidden! Colors are sinful! Aesthetics is horrible! Good framing is mediocre!!! Oh, c'mon!!!!!
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  #22  
Old 07-01-2009, 07:46 PM
npecanhuk npecanhuk is offline
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Default Re: What does it mean for you?

Brazil already has famous "Mr. Sebastião Salgado" who's perfect in portraying human misery! I like it! It's art at its highest level! I think he's one of the best in his area. However, I don't think that's the only way of expressing thru photography what's in the world! There's war, there's misery, there are diseases of all kinds and levels of seriousness! Good and talented photographers are the ones who register all that, specially in black and white to make it even more rude, cruel and a good reason for us to have pitiful feelings?????? Is Sunshine forbidden? Are Colors sinful? Is Aesthetics horrible? Is Good framing mediocre? Sharpness, why having that sort of control in our cameras? Everything twisted, blurred, grainy... those are the greatest masterpiece's features! Everything's got to have a deep meaning, specially if it's something related to trouble: a man tortured by his misfortune of being just human! Oh, c'mon!!!!!
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  #23  
Old 07-02-2009, 01:59 AM
fkostas fkostas is offline
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Default Re: What does it mean for you?

Are you just talking to yourself now?

Don't ask questions if you can't handle honest answers.

Farah
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  #24  
Old 07-02-2009, 08:26 AM
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Longroute Longroute is offline
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Default Re: What does it mean for you?

Neyvan,

I’m not sure to understand the motives of your solitary speech but anyway it has some sense to me. I wonder if you want to discuss tastes about photography in a general sense or question the legitimacy of some photographer to post their pictures in TE…, I think that in both cases you are pursuing a lost battle, we can’t avoid people having different tastes than ours and we cannot ban them from TE…

I just want to tell you an example which to me has been a very meaningful experience.
Some years ago in the Marina where I keep my boat I met a Belgian guy who had just arrived from Greece with his sailing boat. As often between sailing enthusiasts we became friends and shared our experiences and travelogs. To go to Greece with my boat was a dream I have been nurturing since long time so I was eager to know first hand reportage about the country and the best islands to visit. He was a very talkative and nice guy and he told me to be a professional photographer… Oh, that’s great! I thought, “can you show me the pictures you shot in Greece?”
That sentence of mine froze him, I saw a strange expression in his face and his manners became awkward and elusive. He first said few excuses, like having difficulty in finding them in the computer but after a while, seeing maybe the disappointment in my face, he switched on the laptop and finally show me about ten or so pictures – mind he spent two years in Greece, one expects a few more pictures than ten! But furthermore the pictures were very particulars: one was a dustbin, another one a dog sleeping, etc., and they could have been shot in any country in the world… you could not see Greece in his pictures… and no composition skill in them, and no care for quality… I was puzzled… Later when he went back to Belgium he sent me the link to his website, a very professional website… full of very creative and “odd” photos. Ah! I understood then why he didn’t want to show me his pictures of Greece, he is the kind of photographer who hates postcards and such, he really doesn’t like to show a place simply and plainly… he knew that I would have been disappointed by his pictures… He has won a lot of awards…
We are still friends, even if we have different tastes about photography.

Last but not least I want to add a quotation by Charles Mingus, the great Jazz composer and Bass player:

“Anyone can play in a strange way, it’s easy.
The difficult thing is to be simple like Bach.
Everybody can turn simple things into complicate ones, creativity is to make simple, grandly simple, the complicate things.”

Charles Mingus

Have a nice week, I’m leaving with my boat, but I’ll come back soon…
Ciao,
Donato
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  #25  
Old 07-02-2009, 10:03 AM
oochappan oochappan is offline
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Default Re: What does it mean for you?

Mmmm, Donato,

your plea makes me think about a long discussion I had with a retired pro-travel-photographer:
he always pleaded for incongruity ( the never seen before ) in photography.

And indeed some photographers simply look for nothing else then that:
- they go to wars where no other photographer dare to come
- they look for dumps or trash of life
- they use techniques like 'trash your photo-action scripts' to make it stand out
- or tend to crop body parts, volatilizing persons as only compo-elements, tilting and so on .....
- or shooting wild, camera a shotgun, not even aiming or blind, selecting those unique shots after
- or aiming for suggestive frames, not even knowing what , adding suggestive comments ( the mysterious aspect )
- the color painters or the B&W composers afraid of color harmony
- some of the so many techniques for chasing incongruity

All in the name to be incongruous, of course more commercial
but
aren't we something missing here ?

If it is only incongruity you chase,
where is the person behind the camera, did he trade his soul for commerce ?

I would rather believe in a concept that is part of you, your philosophy using the diversity of techniques,
even incongruity as only a technical aspect besides the so many other techniques,
to achieve series that have more depth seeing together,
that the viewer feels there is more to it then only a superficial incongruous nice empty picture.

Here the question rises again :
art creates money
or
money creates art ?

personal thought,
be true to yourself and be creative at the spot,
truth will out, lies have short legs
and enjoy
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  #26  
Old 07-02-2009, 10:06 AM
npecanhuk npecanhuk is offline
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Default Re: What does it mean for you?

Questioning myself? Yes!!! Questioning the forums? Yes! Honest answers! The world is so heterogeneous! Pros and cons will always exist! Right or wrong exist, but not for everything! Being honest, avoiding killing unless if it's self defense are right and I won't ever let those rules aside (at least will try not to)! But tastes for arts, that cannot be just a matter of wrong or right! Some so-called elite of good photographers, good painters, good musicians who close themselves into clubs and put themselves up on a pedestal crying out to the world they're the GODS in that sort of area! Huuuu!!! That bothers me!!!! That always creates disagreement, dispute, disorder and even war! This race is superior to the other! I think it's quite similar! And so forth!
As for Donato's opinion I found it quite interesting, intelligent, complete and explanatory! I understood your words and I totally agree with them! Yes, I was just speaking up to myself, don't want to ban anything from TE, just think it's a pretty democratic site (at least for TE members and their relationships) where all kinds of photos are welcome, but some insist that theirs with a so-called "highest level" are much more than postcards, fotkas, snapshots, just because they show a drunk man, in black and white, laying on a dirty street with the dog licking his mouth! Just like throwing several colors on a wall and saying that that means the troubles of human misfortune where nothing is concrete and saying that that is high class art and a well painted landscape is called crap! I just don't agree! In a democratic world I have this right, don't I?!
Thank you all and let's keep on with our postings!
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  #27  
Old 07-02-2009, 11:07 AM
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Longroute Longroute is offline
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Default Re: What does it mean for you?

Hello Henk,

Glad to hear you in this forum!

Just let me clarify some points:

“your plea makes me think about …”

Far from me to plead incongruity (as you call it), actually (as you can see from my plain and naïve photos) I’m on your and Neyvan’s side. In your list you couldn’t describe better this attitude for incongruity at any cost, an attitude I’m afraid I cannot share. But I wanted to point out – just an unimportant opinion – that we cannot be so “absolute”, so proudly sure of our way of see the world. As Neyvan said, the world is so heterogeneous and I should say better so! As all figurative arts show (not considering the preposterous “crap” art) the human mind can create order (and then art) out of a disorderly scene or a ugly environment, and by the way that’s just the function of life in a mechanical world dominated by the law of entropy.
I think it’s healthy to question things as you and Neyvan did in this forum, and it’s even healthier not to surrender our minds and judgements to the last fashion or the authoritative opinions of the “experts”, but to have the courage to state one’s own humble vision of the world even in those cases when it is not popular… in a low tone.

”personal thought,
be true to yourself and be creative at the spot,
truth will out, lies have short legs
and enjoy”

That’s exactly my thought!

Ciao,
Donato
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  #28  
Old 07-02-2009, 12:54 PM
adelune adelune is offline
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Default Re: What does it mean for you?

At the beginning... a thought of Claude Dytivon, French photographer who left us in 2008.
"By dint of to watch, I saw!"
And I watched... well...
And I continue to watch.
And I photographed what I saw a lot...
And I photograph what I see... again and always!
And this practice procures me a lot of pleasure!
Intrinsically, my photos are neither good nor bad... neither beautiful nor ugly... they are!
And for you who look at them, they are only worth by the emotion, the pleasure that they awake to you...
If it gives some emotion, some pleasure?!...
And this emotion, this pleasure are not mines... they are yours!
My photos escaped to me!!
And it's well thus!...
My "philosophy"?... To see your pics... too, and to give to see... the days of my life!

For me... that's the photography !
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  #29  
Old 07-03-2009, 02:09 PM
erdna erdna is offline
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Default Re: What does it mean for you?

Hi Casper,

Very well said. You expressed properly what I cannot do.

Andre'
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