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  #31  
Old 09-14-2007, 09:25 PM
happypoppeye happypoppeye is offline
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Default Re: Just an observation & PLEASE- NO POINTS...

...link to your picture that is.
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  #32  
Old 09-14-2007, 09:34 PM
happypoppeye happypoppeye is offline
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Default Re: Just an observation & PLEASE- NO POINTS...

OK...one more needed.
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  #33  
Old 09-15-2007, 02:02 AM
kinginexile kinginexile is offline
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Default Re: Just an observation & PLEASE- NO POINTS...

but just some guys
--------------------

me too, but "some guys" is not a community. And I think this is what somebody commented about, that you can really be so tight as to forget to pay attention to others (the community, that is) outside of you smyley-ing buddies, and favorites.

All sites have their pros and cons, they are pretty complementary at the end of the day for me.
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  #34  
Old 09-15-2007, 02:41 AM
happypoppeye happypoppeye is offline
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Default Re: Just an observation & PLEASE- NO POINTS...

I have to disagree there...my "some guys" are like a little communtiy in TE. Sorry if you don't like it, but it's what I feel. I will ask them and they will probably say the same. We met on TE, we talk outside of TE, we send mail, we exchange PP tips and programs outside of TE...We all critique mainly outside of the "group" also, as no one in it posts everyday but we all critique pretty much everyday. I Know most people don't feel this way and I am glad for my luck here...but it is also the reason I like the site so much...

...and yes, I agree with you on the pros and cons...every site has them

John
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  #35  
Old 09-15-2007, 02:57 AM
stego stego is offline
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Default And do you write so many critiques with or w/o points?

I agree that the point system of TE has its cons, the worst ones being the tendency to form cartels (even if that is done in an unplanned manner) that in turn produce those aberrations of lousy photos getting many points.

Winston Churchill (or was it someone else) once said about democracy that "it is a lousy system but it is the best one we know". I think that apllies to the TE system perfectly (points included). I don't believe that the majority of those more involved in posting and critiquing in TE give so much real importance to the quantity of points they receive, but, let's face it, those green faces function like a kind of (childish?) reward to most of us and the "you write me a critique, I write you another" business contributes much to the formation of groups of friends (yes, I think that too many times the word is appropriate) that despite all the politeness, can actually critique each other effectively.

Finally, I found curious that many of those who flame against some photos getting or not getting the points fall in one or two of the following categories:

1- They post very few critiques a day on average.

2- They use arguments that could be used to turn TE into a kind of "contest site" in which only the "good" photos would get many points.

To those in the 1st category, I just say: considering the high rate of posts, have you ever thought that if everybody was like you probably your "better than the others post" would receive even less critiques? I say out loud that I rarely insist on critiquing more than once the posts of those that don't care to critique my own posts, with or without points. Why? Because writing honest critiques is rather time consuming, so I expect something in return (not in the form of points or sugar coated critiques of course).

To those in the 2nd category, I say that if better photos meant more attention, then TE would be turn into a federation of fan clubs to some divine genious, which looks to me the opposite of one of the objectives of the site. Actually, the less good photos and the less good photographers are those who are needing more critiques so they can improve their work.

SO, BEFORE YOU START ARGUING AGAINST THE POINTS OR ANYTHING, GO WRITE GOOD CRITIQUES OF OTHERS' POSTS!

Take care.
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  #36  
Old 09-15-2007, 03:03 AM
happypoppeye happypoppeye is offline
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Default Re: And do you write so many critiques with or w/o points?

good response...
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  #37  
Old 09-15-2007, 06:14 AM
kinginexile kinginexile is offline
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Default Re: Just an observation & PLEASE- NO POINTS...

my "some guys" are like a little communtiy in TE
---------------------

as i told you, I do understand that you have a community of friends, I do too, just as i do in my life, within a bigger demographic entity . Does you or I having a community of friends make the whole 50 000 membership a community, not really, but I can see it how being part of a website may be called generically a community, why not. A tight community, that I do not think so. That's the only thing I replied about, BTW.

I am not sure what is there to like or not like about giving a different opinion. I did not talk about you and your friends, but about the whole membership. My opinion is that most people pick and choose what they want from TE, it's not bad right there, but this adds up to many dfferent ways to use and log on the site.
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  #38  
Old 09-15-2007, 06:40 AM
kinginexile kinginexile is offline
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Default Re: And do you write so many critiques with or w/o points?

Jose,

sorry I can't help smiling after reading this and 2 pages of your critiques afterward. Just reading you, you are labelling every photo you critique, not good but outstandingly excellent, are these the photos you talk about here, that shoulds never get too many points.....:-)

Secundo, no problem with your lauding of every picture you choose to critique, it is certainly your prerogative, but these are not critiques, these are (often sugar coated) praises, though i will not go the road to say that's because you want smyleys from these guys, you may just be a terribly nice guy, after all.

I also think you should not see wrong-headed, disingenuous intentions in people who are critical of how the points system is used. Think that we could very well see in your comment above that you only care to give praises and smyleys so that people give them back to you, or else, they will never hear from you again, then dressing up that begaviour as genuine honesty.
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  #39  
Old 09-15-2007, 10:00 AM
oochappan oochappan is offline
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Default Re: Just an observation & PLEASE- NO POINTS...

reading last remarks

evaluations would be a nicer definitions to indicate "value" and a win-win situation at the same.
Too easy to tear down
far more challiging to build up,
indicating the present values and adding the possibilities to gain value.
Too often the word critique is used as an excuse that you have to tear down wich put both in a loose-loose situations as a win-loose or loose-win is in fact always a loose-loose situation.

Cartels sometimes give a déjà vue feeling, putting your head in to the sand, loosing incongruity.
Helping others is rewarding though.

An isolated "uhmmmm" remark makes me laugh as much as a marvellous creative written evaluation, this to indicate, don't take all so seriously, basic will always be, you like it or not. Empty your mind for an open wondering creativity as well in taking photos as well as writing reflections, biasing yourself shuts you often off from new things.

Some enjoy to maintain a bookkeeping to reply all who gave an invitive critique, some reply along their mood, sometimes extensively with examples of good evaluations, sometimes with a one liner, so hard to taxate others not knowing their mood or time they have or want to spend.

Short, there is only one sin you can commit in your life, not enjoying it, and sharing this joy makes it double.

A pleasant thing aside: In Tamil they say 'patchai sirripu' translated litterally, green smile, meaning smiling for the money :).
Henk
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  #40  
Old 09-15-2007, 10:35 AM
lukie lukie is offline
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Default Re: Just an observation & PLEASE- NO POINTS...

To Stego,

I don't agree with your first point. Giving critics is an option, not a must... And not everyone has so many time as others, sometimes we need to work (for our boss or at home). So, I don't think it's wrong when I sometimes write only one or four critics on a day, and some other days none. About pictures I find they are not good, sorry : I don't give it the two points...
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