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  #1  
Old 08-16-2006, 12:59 PM
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ALSOM ALSOM is offline
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Default Kicked out Henri's Bike

Likewise the Online Photographer Blog

Another very interesting one on here.

How would have critized this photo if you were new to photography and do not have a clue it was from HCB?
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Old 08-16-2006, 02:20 PM
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Default Re: Kicked out Henri's Bike

For a good laugh look at the kinds of photos those who criticize HCB take:) Start with the Ludt Family, he added a note to the shot.
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Old 08-16-2006, 07:04 PM
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Default Re: Kicked out Henri's Bike

Maybe i'd tell the photographer to stop copying his elders! A bit joking, it's quite a picture, but part of the type of things HCB did that do not engage me too much beyond the timely capture. On the other hand, there are truly shades of Bauhaus reminiscence, as well as surrealism, so it shows many a picture deserve a longer look , but for me, this is a spatial pun type of pix, whereas some may find there is something that goes beyond its formalism.
I am both in awe of HCB (he is ZE P. of the 20th century), and just not exactly that much taken, gut-wise, by so much of what he did. There is something reluctant about his photography, just as there is, when he talks about it ("i am not a photographer..."). A very detached personality, and this can be certainly part of the panoply of a great photographer. But I prefer people like Lewis Hine or Salgado, and also some TE members, who are as instrumental in making me improve and look better, as the old museum-ed geniuses.

sorry for digressing.

H
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Old 08-16-2006, 09:30 PM
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Default Re: Kicked out Henri's Bike

I thought photo by HCB was fanstastic (honestly didn't know it was his, went number of time through his magnum portfolio and don't remember seeing it there), at least even though I can't take great photos I have a good taste;-)
It puts a big grain of salt into internet discussions,;-)
Love such experiments.
Peter
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Old 08-16-2006, 11:03 PM
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Default Re: Kicked out Henri's Bike

actually peter, you have to have an account to be able to have access to all the archives. i'm assuming that you'll find lots of other photographs of bresson including the one in this link in the archives since he was one of the founding members..
however many members choose not to keep a lot of their work with magnum.
for example, raghu rai has only a small fraction of his life's work with magnum. however there are a large number of incredible photographs taken by him which you'll only find in some rare books or at his home.. if you're lucky you can help in printing some of them for exhibitions ;)

if you get to see his whole collection or atleast more than what you see online, you'll see him in a totally different dimension..

the same goes for a photographer like ara guler.. i'm sure evren can also provide some interesting points here.. you hardly have any of guler's work online.. but there has to be a reason why he was listed as one of the 7 best photographers in the world at the same time as bresson, avedon, halsman and others..
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Old 08-17-2006, 04:58 PM
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Default Re: Kicked out Henri's Bike

The question I wonder is if you don't have any photography culture (for any reasons) and not yet good at photography, how would you appreciate this photo? In such case, I don't think some comments are non-sense as they might be commented with reference to individual's background (of course you may say with bad or good tastes). Other way round, do you need a photo culture to appreciate a photo as it should be ?

I think it's an interesting discussion, feel free to share your point of view.
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Old 08-17-2006, 07:33 PM
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Default Re: Kicked out Henri's Bike

Yes, absolutely, people can appreciate a different type of pictures without having a "photo culture". In the case of HCB's, I suppose if planted totally out of context in a daily newspaper, they might pass over, but still, art can penetrate one's subconscious in very subtle ways, it might be the only thing they recall from the daily that day.

For that pix for ex., there is a centrifugal movement that people can relate to in a very primal, visceral way. This is a shot very easy to describe, unless you have no idea what life in a city looks like. Anyone can relate to it, then there are 2 ways to see it. One, uncultured if you will, like many photos, it gets you physically or not, you feel attracted and it leaves a mark on you. the other, being able to study it, against the history of photography, of 20th ct Art, with as many references to the technical side, but also the intrinsec idiosyncraties of the artist himself. And etc...

Now, there are tons of people who thrive on being and staying ignorant, and the philistine culture around them comforts them in feeling right, and a god-given right at that, about it. It reminds me of a guy who could not understand why i listen to "classical" music, for him, if anything, that was just music to dim the lights off and start kissing your date. It's always something....
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Old 08-18-2006, 05:59 PM
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Default Aiiii!

That thing on flickr is so tragi-comic... oh my lord.

I think the thing about the deleteme group is that they thrive on being able to have veto power. It's exciting to be able to be the ultimate arbiter of what constitutes art. I think it's because of this that they failed to consider the photo on its actual merits: they were too caught up in the frenzy of vetoing.

To be honest, I might have criticized the HCB shot as being too soft, but otherwise considered it a success. But then HCB has informed my aesthetic...

I'm not sure that we can afford to be snobby about this though. Does it make us better beings because we can see the merits of this photo and the deleteme people couldn't? (I like to think I don't think so, but I think I do ;))
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Old 08-18-2006, 06:58 PM
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Default Re: Aiiii!

I'm not sure that we can afford to be snobby about this though. Does it make us better beings because we can see the merits of this photo and the deleteme people couldn't? (I like to think I don't think so, but I think I do ;))
========================================
When I visited the museum of modern art half of the time I had no idea why anyone would consider some of the stuff art, but at the same time I don't join "trash it" group;-).

In the delete me group (and it applies to some extend to anyone who has decided critizise others, including TE), poeple have decided publicly to express their opinions, hence they also deserve to be critisized for what they write. Such settings are flawed from the beginning unless you have folks who have similar and well defined interests, are at a similar level when it comes to being educated on the subject, if that's not the case you run into tragi-comedy, and when there is a "pro" besides a name, it's even funnier.
Peter
canon 350d, sigma 20 1.8, uv filter, 1gb lexar, leather strap, black bag, red mouse, grey cat, beige computer, samsung cell phone, sony tv, chevrolet.
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  #10  
Old 08-19-2006, 05:39 AM
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Default Re: Aiiii!

Well, I must say I spent a little more time over this shot, and I have to revise my opinion. I think it's a great work of Art, that speaks to us beyond its formalism. I read some comments on the flickR site about it, and ot shows that people have preconceived idea about what a photo should be totally antinomic to what great Art is, something that touches you deeply DESPITE its perfection/imperfections.
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