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  #81  
Old 09-26-2007, 10:03 AM
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eleparc eleparc is offline
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Default Re: Just an observation & PLEASE- NO POINTS...

come on Nicolas, i have met you once in London and you are the nicest guy! fishing for compliments, for lack of points? haha!
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  #82  
Old 09-26-2007, 10:53 AM
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Default Re: Just an observation & PLEASE- NO POINTS...

Once in a while I think about this points vs critiques issue. It is a recurrent theme on this forum, everybody complains about it, everyone likes to state that points don't matter. But the truth is that points do matter!

In my opinion, the problems associated with this whole critiquing system is the symbiosis between points and critiques. To me, points and written critiques should be completely separated. Points could be completely anonymous...

Let's take the example of photo.net. Their system used to rate photos in three levels: aesthetics, originality and technical merit. They present the number of ratings conceded and the average marks of the three indicators. Points here on TE would benefit from a similar approach. I am not saying to implement three levels, our 0/1/2 points isn't bad, but linking points to people always produces the kind of problems you all are aware of. Because when you look at a photo in the gallery, you look at his rating and not at the critiques.

Here in TE we have the ability to critique every single photo but are only allowed to rate 20 pictures a day. So why can't I rate anonymously the worst 20 pictures with zero points and critique the best 10 without awarding any points? Wouldn't a rate of 2 points per 20 ratings given be a clear sign of a bad photo?

The problem is that points do mean almost nothing these days around here. I say "almost" because I still consider that a photo with big score is indeed a good photo. Of course there are exceptions - when the member is an avid critiquer and posts very scarcely, for example - but in general the good photos receive good scores. On the contrary, the bad ones are completely overlooked and don't receive any points/critiques at all because TE is orientated to praise things and not to point the flaws.

What I would like to see was a system that would keep our fantastic ability for writing critiques - and believe me, there are few sites that have as good critiques as the ones we read here every day - while allowing to build a rating system that actually mean something in terms of photography and not only in terms of ego boosting.

Why not create a thread to give some suggestions to the new admin on how to improve the rating system?

Luis
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  #83  
Old 09-26-2007, 11:01 AM
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lukie lukie is offline
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Default Re: Just an observation & PLEASE- NO POINTS...

Luis,

take a look on what I wrote on 13 september... It's the same idea.

Luc.
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  #84  
Old 09-26-2007, 11:20 AM
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Default good idea

Luis,
Since march I started to give the points I felt I should give.
2, 1, 0, NP, all of them.
I started to write comments also again and I now people are starting to give me one point also.
I feel great about that.
It's not because of the points, but because I get much more response! Good response with personal notes, suggestions, thank yous . . . . I have a feeling people, even when they are just a few, realy look at my photo's and that they appreciate I take time for their photo's.

The good ones you will find anyway, regardless their points, just as you say above.

I think we can help our selfs better with a small change in mentality.

Still, I also think that your question should get support, lots of it :)

regards,
David
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  #85  
Old 09-26-2007, 11:36 AM
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eleparc eleparc is offline
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Default Re: Just an observation & PLEASE- NO POINTS...

"in general the good photos receive good scores"
--------------------------------------------------

to make a long story short, i agree with you Luis except for one thing : "in general the good photos receive good scores". I am always amazed by the discovery of some real pearls in this overall ocean of photos with very little scorage while some more than average photos get over 100, see 150 points! it is what others would call marketing!

So your idea of separating points from critiques and anonymizing the points seems indeed a good solution to help clean up this mess!

Eric
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  #86  
Old 09-26-2007, 11:42 AM
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Default separating points from critiques

except for the mess :),

I second the motion.
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  #87  
Old 09-26-2007, 11:49 AM
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eleparc eleparc is offline
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Default Re: separating points from critiques

ok i agree to withdraw the mess part ;-)
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  #88  
Old 09-26-2007, 11:50 AM
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Default Re: separating points from critiques

:-)))
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  #89  
Old 09-26-2007, 12:44 PM
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Default Re: Just an observation & PLEASE- NO POINTS...

Hi Dan,

My dear God, you have no idea how I waited for someone to say this!!

It is true. I sometimes wonder why I should bother posting. It's not the points. It's the lack of constructive comments on a decent shot. If you get comments (out of your closer group of people posting), they will be 'Nice one. Good light. Cheers...'. Okay, I can have that once or twice, I do it sometimes as well though a bit more constructive. But if 75% of the comments are like that...

You're right. It's sad...

Dennis
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  #90  
Old 09-26-2007, 12:58 PM
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Dpbours Dpbours is offline
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Default Re: Just an observation & PLEASE- NO POINTS...

Haha, I like the reply of Eric on your NoooHooo I'm not a friendly person... ;-)

If a picture is not any good, I'll be the first one to say it. I don't make friends there, for sure. But I'll be as good with friendly advice if I feel it would help.
And yes, being harsh sometimes and not making friends in that sense does guarantee a low no of points. I don't care about that, but I do care about the low level of the comments I get - outside my close group of TE members.

Dennis
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